Pixar’s Pete Docter: If Inside Out 2 Doesn’t Succeed, We Have to ‘Radically’ Rethink Our Business

As a seasoned film critic with years of experience under my belt, I must say that the anticipation surrounding Inside Out 2 is palpable. Having seen the original leave a lasting impression on audiences worldwide, the sequel indeed carries a significant responsibility on its digital shoulders.

Originally released on June 11, 2024, we’re re-sharing this story now to coincide with the launch of Inside Out 2 on Disney+, which is set for September 25, 2024.

Pete Docter understands that the bar is set high for the upcoming film, Inside Out 2. Docter joined Pixar at just 21 years old and swiftly climbed the ladder of success, contributing to iconic productions such as Toy Story. He later moved on to directing films like Up and Monsters Inc., in addition to the original Inside Out, which stands as Pixar’s highest-grossing non-sequel. In 2018, he was appointed as Pixar’s Chief Creative Officer. With a total of nine Oscar nominations and three wins under his belt, Docter is no stranger to recognition in the film industry.

In recent times, Pixar has been struggling commercially and critically, with films such as “Turning Red” and “Luca”, which were rooted in the creators’ personal childhood experiences, not having the same impact on audiences as more universally relatable stories like “Toy Story” and “Monsters Inc.” Director Pete Docter explains that it becomes increasingly challenging to generate original ideas that strike a chord with a diverse audience as Pixar enters its 28th film production. “Many people say, ‘I always thought toys came to life when I wasn’t in my room.’ ‘I always believed there were monsters under my bed,'” he notes. “We’re still searching for such ideas, but it’s getting more and more difficult as we progress.

Since Disney released films such as “Turning Red,” “Luca,” and “Soul” (which Docter co-directed) on their streaming platform Disney+ during the pandemic, Pixar has found it challenging to entice viewers back into cinemas. In the last two years, both “Lightyear” and “Elemental” fell short of box office expectations. Consequently, the studio must adapt its creative approach and business plan by revisiting the franchises that initially captivated fans, such as “Inside Out.

Movie analysts are anticipating that the release of “Inside Out 2” will make it one of the top-earning films in 2024, and cinema owners are hoping this film will entice families back to theaters, as the year has been sparse in kid-friendly content. In summary, the movie industry is experiencing a difficult period. The Memorial Day box office reached a 26-year low due to several high-budget films falling short of expectations. It’s possible that audiences prefer watching movies, including children’s films, from home instead of paying a substantial amount for a theater visit.

The fate of Pixar, this year’s box office performance, and movie theaters in general could potentially rely on the success of movies like Inside Out 2. As Docter puts it, “If it doesn’t perform well at the theater, I believe we might need to reconsider our business strategies even more creatively.

In the sequel of Inside Out, titled Inside Out 2, we find ourselves catching up with Riley a few years later as she prepares for high school. The inner emotions personified within her mind – Joy, Sadness, Anger, Disgust, and Fear – are jolted from their slumber by an alarm labeled “Puberty,” followed by the arrival of new roommates: Embarrassment, Ennui, Jealousy, and Anxiety. Joy (Amy Poehler) and Anxiety (Maya Hawke) engage in a struggle over how to navigate Riley through her challenging teenage years.

Dr. Docter explained to TIME his rationale behind Pixar’s emphasis on producing more sequels, their approach to discovering universal themes that resonate with a broad audience, and the fact that there won’t be live-action versions of Pixar’s animated films, including no remake of Ratatouille in this case, I’m afraid, Josh O’Connor.

Why did you think there was enough in the Inside Out story for a sequel?

As a passionate movie enthusiast, I’ve helped create vast oceans for Nemo, sprawling universes for Wall-E. Yet, when Inside Out made its grand entrance, the most intriguing set we’d constructed was nestled within a young girl’s mind. In the first film, we only got a glimpse of about 3%, leaving behind a treasure trove of unexplored territory and countless ideas waiting to be brought to life.

However, the main point is whether this idea about anxiety, which we discussed with Kelsey Mann, former head of story on both “Onward” and “Monsters University,” held significant weight. It seemed like a topic that could be developed further as it appeared particularly promising.

My editor showed the trailer to her kids, and they were like, “What’s anxiety?” Do you think that concept will go over the head of a six-year-old? 

Absolutely! Just as emotions such as Anger and Sadness were presented in the initial film, it sparked numerous conversations among parents. Following the release of the first movie, countless individuals shared experiences like, “Now I have the resources to discuss these topics with my children.

It was particularly applicable to young boys who often struggle expressing their emotions. Whether it’s due to genetic factors or societal influences, it seems they found a strong resonance, particularly with anger. A significant aspect of this endeavor has been transforming abstract concepts into tangible realities.

“Given that audiences have grown accustomed to watching Pixar movies on Disney+ due to their direct release there, how can we encourage these audiences to return to theaters when Pixar releases new films?

A key aspect of our approach is striving to mix new content with more follow-ups (sequels). It’s a challenging task indeed. Often we hear questions like, “Why don’t they create more unique content?” But when we do, it tends to go unnoticed because people aren’t accustomed to it. Sequels, however, are appealing as viewers think, “I recognize this, I know I enjoyed it before.” In that sense, sequels prove quite beneficial.

Instead, you might say that these creations are often more challenging than originals due to the need for innovation. Instead of repeating the same concept, we strive to add something new and unexpected to keep audiences engaged.

The film “Lightyear” didn’t meet expectations at the box office. If future plans involve more sequels or spin-offs based on its storyline, what can we learn from this spin-off failing to connect with audiences?

After failing to connect with the audience, we realized we had assumed too much about their level of nerdiness. Instead of instantly recognizing an obscure reference to the first Toy Story movie, it seems they were more interested in seeing familiar characters like Mr. Potato Head or Woody. In simpler terms, our attempt at a complex and subtle reference might have been lost on them.

Could you tell me what specific qualities or themes you prefer in unique movie concepts that would entice audiences to go to cinemas?

It’s somewhat pessimistic to suggest that people prefer familiar things, but it seems we’re all striving for that in some way. We aim to discover something that resonates with them, making them think “Ah, yes, I’ve experienced that. This rings true as a universal truth about life.” And achieving this has become increasingly challenging.

Many people used to imagine that their toys would come alive when they weren’t around, and they believed there were monsters hiding in their closets. However, it becomes increasingly challenging to find such beliefs as we grow older and are more immersed in our 28th film or similar entertainment.

A Bloomberg article highlighted that in the future, Pixar will focus more on creating films from universal truths rather than personal anecdotes of creators’ childhoods. However, it’s a common journalistic principle that the specific can represent the universal.

I believe that too.

So how do you find that balance?

It seems there might have been some confusion due to those movies not being overly detailed, but rather personal in nature. You often find that when sharing a personal story, people can become protective and corrective because they feel their account is accurate. However, we’re not recounting a personal narrative; instead, we’re crafting a tale tailored for a fictional character. This can sometimes make it difficult to let go and allow the movie to evolve as needed.

Andrew Stanton, the filmmaker behind Nemo, drew deeply from personal experiences when creating the story. Though he isn’t a fish or a single father in real life, he could relate to overprotectiveness towards his child, which served as a foundation for his imaginative tales about octopuses and other exciting, playful themes.

The story shouldn’t come fully formed. You’re always adding and removing stuff. It’s an organic, messy process. But sometimes, your own personal experience can drive that and other times it can get in the way.

Practically, how does that work? The Pixar braintrust gives more input into every movie?

Instead of getting captivated by “This is truly ingenious,” let’s delve deeper prior to their release to understand, what’s the fundamental concept? Alright, it appears that this revolves around the challenges faced by parents or the grief experienced after losing a loved one.

It was announced that Pixar will produce fewer short-form content for Disney+ to concentrate on features. However, the eight-minute episodes of Bluey have gained immense popularity on the platform. I wonder if this success is partly due to our shorter attention spans today, and whether it encourages Pixar to reconsider the short-form content market.

Initially, when Disney+ was launched, we quickly produced a series of shorts. However, viewers seemed to prefer full-length films from Pixar instead. Consequently, these shorts didn’t generate the expected success, failing to justify the effort invested in their creation. As a result, Disney requested us to focus more on feature films rather than short content.

It turns out that a film’s success on Disney+ tends to increase with its box office performance. At first glance, it might seem counterintuitive since those who have already seen it in theaters wouldn’t be expected to watch it again on Disney+. However, this assumption is incorrect, and it actually makes sense for a few reasons. I recall as a child having an album of The Muppet Show and playing it repeatedly because as kids, we find comfort in rewatching familiar content multiple times.

That’s true for us on Disney+. I don’t know if it’s true on Netflix.

This morning, I noticed that Super Mario Bros. has been a top-rated title on Netflix’s chart for an impressive 25 weeks. It seems that, consistent with your observation, the film was successful in theaters and is now thriving on streaming platforms as well.

That’s the identical model. Frankly, I’d like to extend the theatrical release period as much as possible. Creatively speaking, it would be fantastic to give audiences a sense that if they don’t catch this now, they might have to wait quite some time before it becomes easily accessible in their homes.

It’s surprising to see a large number of high-budget films from this summer being made available for premium video on demand just two weeks following their initial release.

It’s crazy. 

Inside Out 2 has a 100-day release window. That feels like a statement.

We only had that length of time for the movie Elemental. When it was first released, many of us felt disappointed, saying something like, “Oh no, it didn’t start as well as we expected!” However, over time, the film proved to have staying power. I’m not sure if the marketing was off, the market was too saturated, or people found it uninteresting at first glance. But positive word of mouth got people curious and made them want to watch it. I believe this wouldn’t have happened if we had released it three weeks later on Disney+.

Analysts in the industry are predicting a strong start for Inside Out 2 at the box office this weekend. Should the movie underperform, both the summer season and Pixar Studios could be in trouble. What’s your take on the situation?

It’s hard for me to envision a greater opportunity for a blockbuster success than this film, given its popular source material, beloved characters, and hilarious ensemble cast. I’m also hoping there’s a substantial, emotionally resonant core to the story that audiences can connect with on a deeper level.

If our film underperforms at the box office, I believe it may be time for us to reconsider our approach to managing the business. To date, Pixar has been successful by investing in substantial budgets, which allows us a degree of flexibility to make mistakes and take risks. Even if something doesn’t succeed initially, we can always go back and adjust accordingly.

In essence, creating something affordably means coming up with an idea and executing it. However, to produce something of quality, you need to brainstorm extensively and continuously refine your work – which is exactly what we’ve been doing thus far. If the market or financial aspects don’t support this approach, then we may have to make significant adjustments again.

What shifts have been made? [Pixar had a round of layoffs in May.]

We’ve already been able to tuck our budgets way down. We’ve made films in much fewer weeks. 

During the era of movies like Monsters Inc. and Ratatouille, there was a sense of expansiveness or openness that allowed for greater exploration. However, that freedom is being trimmed back now, and we’ll need to be more selective and cautious in taking risks.

It seems you brought up Ratatouille earlier. By any chance, are you aware that Josh O’Connor from The Crown has been expressing his fondness for Ratatouille during his media interviews lately?

No!

Is there an ongoing effort among fans to have him cast in a real-life Ratatouille movie? Would your team ever think about creating live-action adaptations?

I must admit, there’s a part of me that finds it troubling, but here goes: I have a preference for creating distinct and innovative films, and the idea of remaking something doesn’t really appeal to me on a personal level.

That’s maybe for the best because I don’t know how you make a live-action rat cute.

Creating within these animated worlds can be challenging because so much of what we construct relies on their unique rules. For instance, a human walking into a floating house would raise questions in our minds: “Hold on, houses are heavy… how can balloons lift it?” But in the realm of cartoons, if a character stands in a floating house, we tend to suspend disbelief and accept it without question. The worlds we’ve designed don’t always transfer smoothly into reality.

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2024-09-23 23:07