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Lucy Dacus on L.A., a layered love life and the ‘horny poetry’ of her new album

BBG News

On a breezy early March afternoon in Elysian Park, Lucy Dacus is perched at a picnic table, squinting against the sun. Yesterday, the 29-year-old musician attended Elton John’s annual Oscar gathering to witness Chappell Roan—a fresh acquaintance—perform “Pink Pony Club” with Sir Elton. This evening, she intends to join forces with friends, including Roan and Katie Gavin from the band Muna, to see Heart perform at Crypto.com Arena. Later on, Nancy Wilson of Heart will share backstage snaps of their group on Instagram.

After enjoying various activities, Dacus is now here to discuss her latest album titled “Forever Is a Feeling” – her fourth solo project, but the first one she’s produced since gaining pop stardom as part of Boygenius, the renowned indie-rock trio that also includes Phoebe Bridgers and Julien Baker. This album is meticulously crafted and introspective, with most tracks focusing on love and desire for Baker, whom she’s now in a long-term romantic relationship with. “Best Guess” yearns to trace Baker’s tan lines and zip her dress, while “Ankles” asks a lover to bite her on the shoulder, pull her hair, and solve crossword puzzles together in the mornings.

Gavin praises Lucy’s unique ability to portray genuine, intimate relationships that retain the enchantment of longing and imagination. He will be opening for Dacus on tour this year, including two shows at L.A.’s Greek Theatre in May. In essence, he finds that she skillfully makes real-life intimacy captivating.

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The upcoming album “Forever,” set to release on March 28 from Geffen Records, carries an influence from Phoebe Bridgers’ collaborative project Boygenius, which garnered three Grammy Awards, graced the cover of Rolling Stone as Nirvana, and opened for Taylor Swift on her Eras Tour. In “The Tortured Poets Department,” Swift references Dacus by name in the title track. The 2023 Boygenius album, “The Record,” is rich with insightful musings about art and culture, including the song “Leonard Cohen,” which grapples with Cohen’s “erotic poetry” penned during a personal crisis at a Buddhist monastery. On “Forever Is a Feeling,” Dacus delves further into the absurdities of fame — as expressed in “Come Out” where she sings, “I missed your call because I was in a boardroom full of old men speculating about youth trends.” Despite this, Dacus appears to be at minimal risk of getting swept up in the limelight.

Says Gavin: “Basically, the babe’s got a good head on her shoulders.”

Born into a deeply religious family in Virginia, Dacus later recorded “Forever” in collaboration with artists such as Bridgers, Baker, Hozier, Blake Mills, Bartees Strange, and Madison Cunningham in both Los Angeles and Nashville. A week after performing some of her new songs at the Huntington, I had a conversation with her. Her audience listened so attentively during this performance that clapping felt almost impolite.

You currently reside in Los Angeles, correct?

Previously, I must admit, when I first visited, I wasn’t particularly fond of the place. I believe I may have encountered less-than-favorable neighborhoods and didn’t connect with enough people. However, as I made more friends here, I began to understand how one can grow to love this city. Now, I find myself quite smitten with it.

Previously, our conversation revolved around the fact that you resided with multiple roommates in Philadelphia. Currently, I continue to frequent Philly, with your friends still inhabiting that same house. The East Coast’s charm, including its greenery and creeks, is deeply missed by me. This place marks my first residence where I no longer hear the sound of a train passing by.

It appears that Boygenius was the factor that led you to move towards the west. Since we were there quite frequently – recording the album, doing press, and making music videos – Julien and I started thinking, “Wow, we’re spending so much on hotels, it would be better if we just got a place here.” Phoebe has played a significant role in my affection for this city; she suggested, “Forget all that other stuff. Eat at these spots. Meet these people.

Music

The long-established rock group, which had paused tours due to Ann Wilson’s cancer diagnosis last year, is now set to continue performing again.

In your own words, you’re asking about someone’s thoughts on Sabrina Carpenter’s song “Dumb & Poetic,” where she references a guy being attracted to Leonard Cohen. You shared that Leonard Cohen was going through an identity crisis in a monastery, yet still managed to be sexually active. You find this admirable and wish the same vitality for everyone. If Sabrina’s project is about sexual attraction and intelligence, then it makes sense she’d be into Leonard Cohen, as who could be more intelligent and attractive?

While listening to “Forever Is a Feeling”, I recalled the lyrics from Boygenius, as it seemed quite rich in sensual verses.

Is that reasonable or just? Well, undeniably, there seems to be a hint of impending loss and fear. However, I attempted to incorporate some elements that are purely driven by desire.

Was composing that type of music a fresh endeavor for you? To be honest, it was simply a new venture in my life, and the music represents an extension of that. I often write from a place that is intellectual or cerebral, so to compose primarily from the physical self was both thrilling and slightly humiliating. I believe humiliation is crucial – it indicates concern, it signifies taking a risk, and most importantly, it shows one is truly pushing boundaries.

I haven’t explicitly considered the idea that listeners interpret “Ankles” as a song about queer desire, but I have noticed an increase in discussions about queerness since Boygenius. I don’t use pronouns in my music because I cherish connecting with what feels like my community, and ideally, I would like this community to be made up of lovers, which everyone can be. For me, “Ankles” was less about queerness and more about shedding shame, a feeling that I associate with living a more openly queer life.

Who else among authors stirs your deepest longings, excluding Leonard and Sabrina? My choices are James Baldwin, Garth Greenwell, and Jeanette Winterson. I’ve recently been engrossed in the works of the Brontë sisters, one after another.

What made Boygenius visit the Brontë museum in England was being immersed in “Jane Eyre” at that time, followed by recently reading “Wuthering Heights”, and planning to read “Agnes Grey” next. The characters in these novels were suppressed and yearned for romance, and despite the world being much different today, I believe many people can relate to this longing. It’s intriguing to me how people crave a profound, otherworldly love that could make someone your adversary, yet you still feel an unwavering and inexplicable affection towards them.

As a dedicated cinema-goer with a deep appreciation for music, I’ve always been intrigued by artists who can capture desire so poignantly through their songs. From the timeless tunes of Labi Siffre, whose work has held me captive for years, to the soulful melodies of Billie Holiday and Julie London, these women have a unique ability to evoke powerful emotions. Even Barbra Streisand, with her versatile talent, can make you feel every ounce of heartache in a love song, making it all the more real and tangible.

Am I a fan of Barbra Streisand’s book?
I haven’t read her book, so I can’t say I’m a fan of it. However, growing up with my mom’s love for musical theater has certainly influenced me in ways I didn’t realize. I believe some exceptional singers, whose storytelling was embedded in the very tone of their voices, have had a greater impact on me than I initially understood.

Oh, SZA — just to add to the bards.

In a surprising turn of events, I recently came across a video on TikTok that featured you in a dressing room at Joni Mitchell’s concert last year at the Hollywood Bowl. This gathering included not only you but also Joni Mitchell, Elton John, Brandi Carlile, and Annie Lennox. It was quite surreal. I’ve just developed the film from that night – I usually carry my small camera along, particularly for moments like these that I wouldn’t ordinarily anticipate in my life. I thought to myself, “I need a photo to validate this experience later.” Brandi extended an invitation to me, and I brought Chappell along. They encouraged us to visit again and before we knew it, we found ourselves right smack in the middle of an iconic circle of legends.

What’d you think of Joni’s show that night?
It was one of the most profound shows I’ve ever seen.

She delves into many significant details.
She caters to those who are truly perceptive. She aims to please those who have been attentive, and there’s a great deal of admirable sincerity in her efforts.

Occasionally, I’m apprehensive about an artist’s new album after they reach stardom due to the sense of disappointment that can feel all too familiar. However, in your latest songs, you tackle that experience in a novel manner which feels refreshing. When I interact with celebrities, we often discuss our stalkers within minutes. It seems everyone bears some scars, so yes, you write from a more sheltered perspective now compared to your early music where you were less guarded and wrote freely about everything. I find myself still writing in that unguarded style, which I enjoy, but it makes me feel exposed when I share it. Yet, I believe the openness is worthwhile, and I’m proud of this album. But I understand why some people choose to withdraw.

Taylor Swift singing your name gave a vivid impression of your fresh circumstances.
To ward off its overpowering significance, I’ve developed mental barriers. Fortunately, I am surrounded by individuals who have known me intimately and loved me for a long time. That’s truly where my core resides.

Back in 2021, you shared that you value friendships over romantic relationships, finding the diversity in friendships more captivating. Now, since you’ve transitioned into a more pop-oriented sphere—

Were you under any pressure to discuss love since it’s often associated with pop stars? Absolutely not. To be honest, when we last spoke, I wasn’t particularly smitten. Instead, I found myself immersed in deep, multifaceted friendships. These relationships have grown so intricate that they’ve unveiled new layers for me to explore. And as it happens, my romantic entanglements have become just as complex. Interestingly, all of my love interests were once dear friends before anything else. So, the idea of a casual date or interrogating each other to determine our compatibility feels alien to me – more like a scene from a movie than real life!

To put it another way, I’m sticking by my statement, and I’ve come to find that romance often involves ambiguity. It seems to me that people follow a structured approach and adhere to certain guidelines in romance, which I believe contradicts the essence of love. This structure reminds me of the commercialization of love: You provide specific actions to receive emotional safety. To me, it feels a bit manipulative. My friends, whom I cherish, prepare for dates in such a manner that I sometimes wonder if they’re trying to deceive the other person or conceal their true selves.

Sometimes, I feel unsure and a bit shaky. For instance, listen to the song “Please Stay” – my voice cracks towards the end due to emotion, which is evident in the recording. However, the power of the music might be rooted in its theme of constant uncertainty. So if I’ve reached any destination, it’s understanding that there will always be unknowns and accepting things as they are. That could be what you sense in my singing.

Music

A well-known musician hailing from Texas is on the verge of launching his first big-label release, this time with his fifteenth studio album.

How did you envision the sound of this fresh release? It seems quite distinct from “Home Video,” released in 2021.
I believe it does too. I was considering love songs across different eras, going as far back as some artists we previously discussed, and even reaching further into history for the visual aspects, to the Pre-Raphaelite period. My intention was to link these tunes with a timeless narrative of love. Hence, you’ll find violins, harpsichords, harps, and other elements in the arrangements that lend an older or classic feel to it.

Reflecting on my experiences with Boygenius and our epic rock shows, I can’t help but ponder the influence those road trips had on shaping my sound world. It’s not just about the raw power of rock anymore; it’s about understanding the essence of each song and how to present it in a way that truly resonates. Each tune seems to whisper its own unique genre, making me feel like I’m part of a diverse musical landscape rather than a single genre. Hearing you mention ‘pop’ earlier made me curious, as I don’t see myself strictly within one genre.

It seems I was referring to “pop” in a broader sense, encompassing cultural or industrial aspects – more specifically, the grand entrance into the major label scene. Working with Geffen is fantastic; Matador was a good beginning. However, since I did most things myself and there wasn’t much funding, it didn’t feel right to present this as an indie project anymore. So, let’s create an oil painting for the album cover, shoot a music video in Paris, commission a Rodarte dress – I wanted to showcase the talents of those dedicating so much effort and skill to their craftsmanship.

It appears you’re creating your own universe, and that reminds me of the demands for pop fame in the 2020s. However, I must clarify that I have no intention to contribute to popular culture. There are individuals who actively engage with it, but my focus seems to be more on introspection. For me, the success or failure of the album won’t be determined by its impact or whether it aligns with current trends. Frankly, I’m not entirely certain about my connection with those aspects. After all, I’ve been away from social media for a year, so I might have missed quite a bit.

It sounds like you took a break for about a year after the end of Boygenius, as you felt the need for some creative breathing space. After wrapping up Boygenius, we had stated that it would last for one year, and true to our word, it’s come to an end. We only extended it to perform at the Grammys. Following the Grammys, we decided to take a break – Boygenius is now concluded. I was feeling drained, and when I get too tired, I tend to stop. To avoid stopping, I needed to recharge my energy somehow.

Are the band Boygenius on an extended hiatus? It’s not that they broke up entirely, but at the moment, there are no concrete plans for new projects or performances.

I saw Julien at your show at the Huntington.
My little guy. That’s my No. 1.

It’s quite intriguing how casual you are about social media, considering the significant posts you’ve made. However, I’m unsure of the specific tweets you’re referring to.

Clearly, “War criminal” (with a disapproving expression) in reference to Obama. To Matty Healy, I’m saying, “You rarely hear from me.”
[Chuckles].

Do you find it exciting when one of your witty remarks goes viral?
Surely, I know something’s catching fire when I start receiving dozens of messages within an hour from friends asking if I’m alright. It’s a double-edged sword, much like anything that touches many lives. And with a witty remark, it’s just a few words, you understand? I could have elaborated more to provide context, but when speaking online, it’s often interpreted negatively. I have friends with whom I disagree, yet we manage to find common ground. However, the internet isn’t your friend; it assumes the worst in what you say.

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2025-03-20 13:32

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